alas,Babylon.....

....obscene,unimaginable,and g-d d-mn WRONG. The only way to view the act that occurred.

https://time.com/5869220/navy-vet-federal-agents-portland-protests/

Wow there’s a lot going on isn’t it? Crazy times we’re living in. I remember a saying I’ve heard from time to time that actually makes sense to me. “Play stupid games, Win stupid prizes”

I didn't get gassed or beaten.

But, then again, I was home minding my business.

So,it should be expected that a citizen(and a veteran) who poses a question to a anonymous Federal agent will receive a beating/chem spray for his or her trouble? CHARMING CUSTOM.

Two sides to every coin. Same thing for every story. In the video he was told to step back and he doesn't... that fed wailing with the baton doesn't seem to be doing much damage. Not sure how much of the land around the federal court house counts as federal land. Looks like maybe to the street since they just pushed them back to the street. Been lots of fires and looting and rioting, so guessing they were also on edge waiting for the crowd to finally storm the building. Not siding with the feds, just adding more lines and color to the picture.

"doesn't seem to be doing too much damage",does that include broken bones in his hand? He wound up in the hospital and will need further surgery, as well as being treated for the irritants.

And what a fire-breathing radical! He decided to go,hoping to talk to the agents.He wore clothing to announce his connection with the USN and had hoped to remind them that the oath they swore to the Constitution comes before any oath to any individual.

Really got to watch out for those "overweight,53 year old man" types,he's SO obviously some sort of shill.

We have militarized police in this country. I do not use drugs, I have seen their (users) impact on a community, but at the same time I am stuck wondering if they are work pursuing a domestic war that has lasted nearly 70 years.

Funny how protests for 2nd Amendment rights didn't have anything like this, uet those people didn't loot and destroy business's also! Yes we do have some problems with police in this country, but it doesn't just stem from them but from politicians in general that have allowed this to go on for years. Look at the whole no-knock warrant issue, morons in this country actually believe that these cops do this upon themselves, when politicians and judges have been a part of this since the beginning. People need to stop huffing model glue and wake up to see that we are all slaves to this system and only some have it better!

Charles.

When the law tells you to move, then move, problem solved. In nearly every case of so called cop abuse the morons refuse to comply.

Cows are very good at complying. Up until they step onto the slaughtering belt.

To be clear I am not solely blaming the police, but there is a reason why we teach soldiers about illegal orders. The police have a responsibility to serve and protect their communities, not terrorize them. I think there is a problem when people will duck and hide upon seeing a uniform, not out of guilt, but fear.

Gosh this one is a hotbed issue.

Do we defend the republic, or obey the will of the people?

I dont envy those having to make that choice.

Perhaps this is an oversimplification on my part,but my view has been as follows:

The people are the Republic.
The Constitution and Bill of Rights are how we wish to live as members of the Republic.
Therefore,to defend the Constitution is to defend the Republic AND the people.

Just the way I came up.To modern ears,sounds antiquated,but show me something better.

Perhaps this is an oversimplification on my part,but my view has been as follows:

The(Rich, landowning, central western european white) people are the Republic.
The Constitution and Bill of Rights are how we wish to live as members (or modernly subjects) of the Republic.
Therefore,to defend the Republic is to defend the people (in power as career politicians).

Sorry about that, I rearranged it a little bit to fit my "modern" view.

A teensy bit sarcastic, but my point stands.

The only thing I have to add to this is, as a veteran myself, throwing that tag out on anybody doesn't mean too much to me. There are plenty of veterans that are real pieces of garbage, I served with a few, there are a few on this site.
I'm not saying this guy is or isn't, I don't know him.

It's why he said he went there. People say stuff all the time, doesn't make it true, doesn't mean it wasn't true either. Guilt by association is a terrible thing. If they tell you to back up 2ft, why would you stand there though?

Rosa Parks was a plant, chosen to do what she did. The reason she was chosen was because she was a member of the community with an impeccable record. She was old, a woman and above reproach. That was why it worked.

Seems like an old, fat, navy veteran would be just the type to go and take one for the team.

No sarcasm found,must admit that money has been used to circumvent the Constitution regularly.

But what if the individual refuses to be cajoled,threatened,or bought? It does have a cost,but I prefer to live by the spirit of the Constitution and personal ethics.Sure,it's not easy,but I sleep well.

Those 'protests' are anything but peaceful. The 'protestors' are starting an average of 10 fires per night and they are attacking federal buildings.

The rights of protestors and are protected by 1A, destruction of federal property and assault on federal officers is not.

The failure is the Mayor of Portland and Governor of Oregon failing in their first duty to protect citizens - it's been going on for 59 straight nights and it has NOTHING to do with racism - it's all white people.

Mark, I happen to know and be friendly with a good number of people participating in The protests. These are young people who see this as a worthy cause.

And then there are the rioters. Idk what goes through someones mind as they decide to torch the business outside of which a man was shot by the police. I do not understand what justifies acts of violence motivated by race.

The funniest part of this whole mess is that the whole antiracist movement... is racist. If you disagree with them, you are labeled as a racist/facist. If you don't actively show your support for them the same. It a knee jerk label slapping **VOTE IN NOVEMBER** fest.(forgive the profanity)

Weirdly, it has illustrated a point to me. I have no issue with people who are racist. I take issue with people who are supremacist.

I dont give a rats arse either way as long as it stays off my doorstep

Hahaha. Amen.

These riots are now longer about justice. These are now lead by the anarchists and communists. Their goal is to erase our history and create kaos. As we speak, lawless and rioting, lead by these anarchists and communists, continues in Portland, Seattle, Austin, LA, Oakland, etc.. Crime surges across most other cities causing many of the residents flee to suburban, and rural areas (bringing with them the same political thought process that allowed this to happen). Soon, people will demand law and order and then the communist/socialist and their corporate sponsors will sweep in, eliminating the constitution for the “good” of the state...sounds far fetched?

nato police, full disarmement,

No NATO. More like the elimination of free speech (anything that is not “approved”), religion, movement, association, right to property, due process, etc...Continuation of lowering the standards of living (people must not be allowed to be adequately employed) and forced brainwashing of our children...we are at a pivotal part in our history and we must not remain idle or silent. I fear for ours and our children’s near future.

our grandchildren are screwed

Anyone can choose to protest, that is fine. This had "obviously by the video" turned into a riot. He was asked to move and stood there... what did he think would happen? I'm not buying the "I'm a Veteran" doing nothing wrong and they just attacked me for nothing.

I don't care if people 'protest' peacefully, that includes NOT randomly blocking as well as NOT destroying property and NOT attacking officers or other people. Once that starts they aren't protestors they are rioters and if you are harboring them or letting them use your protest you are a minimum an accessory. Boot them out (by whatever means necessary) or point them out to the police.

I totally agree with this.

Its kinda funny when people protesting police brutality are expected to turn to those same officers for aid. Me personally, I have known several officers who were stand up individuals, the sort who I would buy a drink. I have also personally encountered 3 different officers who had the impression that having a badge and a gun made them the biggest swinging **VOTE IN NOVEMBER** in town. I have twice feared for my life with such officers. The third simply took it upon himself to stop and frisk me on a near daily basis for 3 months.

My best interaction with the cops is no interaction.

My best interaction with officers of the law is one of support, and polite respect.

But please use your head.

To continue...


I don't like the idea of using the US military to attack US citizens. I feel like the people are the core and source of power for any government, and the oppression by force of arms makes ys no better then the commies overseas.

Whats next? Do we start deporting muslims or forcibly sterilize 'undesirables' .

More on that point, if we do use military might to stop protests on police action, what stops the Gov from using that same might against gunowners 'for public safety' to enforce unconstitutional laws and disarmament.

While that is considered a fallacy, these acceleration, I still worry about the consequences of that action.

Heres a suggestion... lets let california seccede, pump it full of these folks, and then carry on with our lives and let the earthquakes deal with them....

So jb what do you propose should be done in cities where the liberal demotard leaders are ordering the city and state police force to stand down and abandon their own building? Should others just let their property be destroyed by these terrorists? So when these federal agencies are out protecting federal property because the liberal demotard leaders in those cities won't, well I have no problem with that! If everyone was like these terrorists, there would be complete anarchy and this country would be like that of a third world.

To start with, I don't much like your language.

Its terms like "liberal demotard", "libtard", "republi **VOTE IN NOVEMBER**" that really turn me off. What that accomplishs is to lump an entire group of people into one lump of ugly. It does nothing to improve discourse, communication, or understanding.


Lambasting completed, I am not aligned with a political party. I do not think the police should stand down. I think those are the actions of frightened career politicians who want to be reelected, and who have no place in their current positions. Simply put, they are some spineless, cowardly, weasely chuckle **VOTE IN NOVEMBER**.

At the core of the Protests is the issue of police brutality, their policies, equipment and training/policies. My personal stance is that a police department does not need a tank, and that police beating protestors went out of style in the 1970's.

Protecting is defensive. When you hear terms like "dominate" or "controlling the battlesphere" it beings to mind military operations overseas. Because that is how it is run.

In most cases, the police response is correct, and restrained. They arent charging into groups and beating them into submission. In cases where rioters are preventing access by emergency vehicles, burning buildings, or otherwise taking criminal action, treat them exactly as if they had taken that action. I fully support prosecution of these criminals, but don't prejudge a large and diverse group.

Simply put, they are some spineless, cowardly, weasely chuckle **VOTE IN NOVEMBER** .) This is ok jb but libtard isnt,. Whodathunk

Where did the US Military attack US citizens? I must be lacking on my news...

Seems to me JB that if your friends are protesting in the streets then maybe it's time you get some new friends.

Apologies for the misunderstanding, that was in response to calls for use of the reserve forces/ armed forces vs riots, with use of extreme force.

I have a belief that our military should not be used against our people. I am not opposed to swift and decisive action targeting leaders and organizers, but the idea of soldiers marching down Pennsylvania ave with purpose chills me.

We do not agree eye to eye on all issues. I happen to see the current narrative of reparations and minority only grants as supporting a different kind of inequality and racial imbalance, one which directly isolates a racial group (defined as whites) and denies them opportunities available to others on the basis of skin colour. I think that hypocrisy can only lead towards further division, and breed resentment.

They have their reasons for what they do, I have mine. I do know that at the end of the day they are good people, ones who stick out their necks for what they believe to be right. I would trust my life to a few, because I know when it came down to it they would have my back.

That kind of loyalty is very important to me, moreso then some political differences.

who would have thought it,such a simple observation(the original post) could go so far off-track.

Ya'll keep at it,and shuffle off to the side that a US vet was abused for asking a question.BTW,appears that the troops in question were probably Border Patrol goon squad (yes,have met some of those zesty fellows,years ago),and THEY ARE BEING USED AS A PRIVATE POLICE FORCE.

My 2 cents

If he simply went down there in hopes of having a discussion with Federal agents, then he already made a poor choice.

Hoping to sip coffee and talk to a group of agents who were sent somewhere due to civil unrest, destruction of federal property and, assault on federal employees was not too smart.

I have not seen the video, nor will it change my position on this matter.
Wrong place and time.
Figure out a more placid environment to have said discussion.

If you go to see a fight, and get in the middle of two fighters......you might get nailed.

I don't feel any worse for him just because he is a Vet. I am a veteran myself.

And on another note, anyone can pick up a Navy shirt from a surplus store and go down to a protest. I'm not saying he is not a veteran, what I'm getting at is law enforcement/federal agents and other folks in general shouldn't assume anything. In fact they and most military folks are trained to never assume anything. That is how you get hurt or killed.

Never assume anything.

Be polite, be professional,
But have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

It's about always being prepared.

The very nature of peaceful protest is to shame the opposition into thinking about their actions.



BTW,read the news services regarding the protesters since the pullback on the goon squad.Seems not only are they PEACEFUL,BUT THEY ARE STOPPING FIRES,ETC. STARTED BY THE BORED BURB KIDS THAT ARE CAUSING THE VIOLENCE.

Also might care to retract that semi-conspiracy theory regarding the gentleman's Navy creds (buy a Navy shirt);he's already been checked out

Now the “protesters” are now burning bibles and the American flag in in front of the court house...what are they protesting again?

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
both are protected forms of protest,seems ya'll got thing about Americans that don't fit into a VERY narrow "party line".

LOL
Maybe it’s the Marxist movement against America and it’s culture while simultaneously trying to erase it’s history. It won’t go as planned...

Its really sad when privileged (by this I mean spoiled) kids from the suburbs can become the violent face of a combined and complex group movement.@Dusty

It is even more sad when those who should be adults want to pick a fight with said kids, and escalate the violence with their tacticool tool kits. When you threaten people with violence, you become the ugly gun toting paramilitary nutjob that the antigunners want all gun owners to be perceived as.

Yeah, the firebombing of the Federal Courthouse was the Feds picking a fight with bored kids from the Burbs...right...just like Dusty and JB, said...

Accept, that's BS...

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12247809/homemade-bomb-explodes-portland-courthouse-downtown-baghdad/

https://www.insider.com/white-protesters...otesters-2020-6


June 2020


https://www.blackenterprise.com/beware-the-white-ninjas-starting-riots-and-scapegoating-black-folks/

January 2020

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2014/11/white-people-rioting-for-no-reason.html

November of 2014.



I, as a melanin challenged young person (Meant Ironically), having moved from my parents ancestral home (where their parent's and parent's parent's immigrated), have found myself stranded and alone.

I do not have a feeling of culture or community, I find myself lacking in connection to those around me.

Part of that is my fault, as an outsider, but I think that this is also a common feeling of my generation.

Lol, yeah that's it...white supremacists running false flag operations...that's just stupid.
It must be the 'great white secret squirrel force', which has its own secret handshake of course, making coordinated attacks in Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Atlanta, Austin, etc., all at once! Those effing guys are amazing!!!

IKR, its almost like the secret society of black jews which runs liberal media. THey want to institute forced sterilization protocols for aggressive males, with mandatory leather mask wearing, so as to further the agenda of the devil worshiping left.

*End of Sarcasm*

JB,I don't think they get the nature of hypebole.

You need to re-read what I said dusty about his service.

I said "I'm not saying he is not a veteran"

Meaning I'm not doubting his service, but one shouldn't assume someone is a servicemember simply because of a shirt. Meaning the agents on the ground should not assume and give him any better treatment or consideration.