THEY'RE AT THE DOOR! A serious post for once!

Heres the scenario:
The SHTF. The economy took another massive dive leaving millions upon millions more without income.
There are now groups of looters all over the country.
LEO/MIL just does not have the man power to defend everyone and you are essentialy left alone to fend for yourself and family.
There is a group trying to gain entry into your home by force.
They are kicking in the door and it will give any second.
You only have a few seconds to grab ONE firearm.
What is in your hands and why did you reach for that first?

if this were to happen today, i would have to reach for the glock simply becuase i can manuveur (SP) easily with a pistol and one extra mag in my hands. ideally, what i would like to have should this ever happen would be a 8+1 (tactical style) shotgun. the wider pattern would definitely come in handy.
i am working on getting a boomstick.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk6Utpg5JcM

AR-15, I want the most firepower I can carry. 5+1 in my shotgun just isn't enough.

Tripp research double stack 38 super with extra mags. Nothin like 21 rounds of super.

I'll start handing these out to family members!

I would have to go with a shotgun and my pistols as backup. More than likely after you shoot a few the rest will most likely run and possibly try another home that may be defenseless.

I would have to reach for my G21 because that's what I have on me. If it's only seconds, I don't have time to get a shotgun, AK, AR or anything else until I go through 14 rounds of .45 JHP. After I get through that, if I have time, then I'll get the big guns out and they would never be far out of reach after that.

In all honesty, it'll probably be my Glock 17 since that's what I generally carry, but hopefully I'd have 15 seconds or so to go grab the AR.

My answers in red:
Why this setup, it's portable, reliable, accurate and more than enough power to drop man or four legged beast.

Hopefully it isn't soon so I can get my 935 SPX and Pistol grip.

Semi-Auto 12ga with Slugs. I won't need to kill them all. Limbs and body parts flying out the door of the first 3 should be enough to clear the rest out.

If not. Everyone in my house has a .45.

A very well spoken response, Agent.

yes this is the current situation but it can get even worse. thats what im getting at. the bottom can completely fall out from under and the dollar will mean literally nothing. also, ive never kicked in a door so ive never witnessed the frame give...shady. ;P
not everyone has the luxury to have motion sensors/lights and/or dogs...what then?
your answers are great, im not disputing that, but not everyone lives in that perfect world where they have the ability to reinforce their homes.
i for one, rent a town home...big freaking glass door to the back yard. if i dont react fast enough my family would be seriously hurt or worse. my dog? a freaking chihuahua...my neighbors? all idiots that will most likely be the ones looting.

This is a very good point; the only people who want to get into your house more than they want to wake up the next day are either

A) Zombies

B) High on some kind of drug, or

C) Not wearing their tinfoil hats

Because of this, it'd be very likely that after the first one or two get whacked, the rest will think better of the situation and leave. In the vein of encouraging this phenomenon, my choice is this.

Wasn't downplaying the gist of yer scenario Joe ... trying to highlight Agents prep now points. Reckon not all of us take into account many that have rentals and such and cannot make permanant upgrades. The ability to afford such things is always a factor too. As pertains yer glass door - if I were in your shoes and had the bucks (check Craigslist), I'd replace the door .. keeping the old one to reinstall later if code / rules so dictated (heard of many ridiculous rules some communities have .. like no clothes line poles for instance). Don't know just what is allowed.

Don't underestimate yer Chee Wha Wha. His job may just be to sound the alarm and alert the boss of an evil force in the kingdom - thus putting the ball in yer court !

If you're handy you could pull the door trim and recess a steel plate reinforcement for the bolt throw. Replace the trim and it aint visible. Keyed inside deadbolts have their pluses and minuses, but they do eliminate the potential to unlock via a broken glass. Old time remedies will give at least a moments notice - stacked (noisy) containers by the door so silent entry is not possible. We do what we can and anything is better than doing nothing.

Your typical door frame gives really easily. We used to have 8 houses on the university property where I work. The houses were all being demolished to make way for new structures so our job was to go in and remove the furniture for future use. They gave us the keys to the houses but it seemed more fun to enter via a boot to the door. We went through all 8 houses and kicked in the front and back doors (16 doors). In most cases it only took 1 kick ...sometimes 2 right where the locking mechanisms are located. The frames crumbled and we were in. Now of course these were houses built in the 70's and had had no kind of reinforcing of any kind. In fact I don't even think there were deadbolts on the houses so if you have deadbolts, you can expect it to take at least 3 kicks.
It was an eye opener. I reinforced my doors at home. I went ahead and put a solid steel door on the back of the house. I'm saving for a steel door for the front now.

It's a toss up as to what I'd grab first as a main gun. If it happened RIGHT THIS SECOND and they busted in, my 9mm pistol is right next to me so that'd be the first thing I could touch.
If they started kicking and I had 5-10 seconds, I'd still grab the pistol but I'd be heading to the safe where I have the AK47 and a 20 round magazine loaded and inserted.
As it is right now, my back room (where I spend a lot of my time) is laid out to offer a lot of good cover. I have a clear line of sights from the back room through the kitchen and into the living room. I can see my front door from where I sit right now. My desk is positioned right next to the doorway in the back room so it offers cover. I didn't do that on purpose but it works out.

it wasnt taken in that context whatsoever. no harm done!

although...there is a shatter resistant film that was mentioned in one of the other threads i can place on those back doors... thanks agent! you got the gears moving!

If it's THAT bad, I'm boarding up the windows with 3/4" plywood.

Ever thought about having cameras/video set up to record event's when you are away?
Something stored off site.

My dogs aren't expected to engage just deter... it's my job to engage...
When things go bump they both know ther jobs, the older dog sits outside my kids rooms(was taught that early on)
My young dog comes with me as she can see and hear what I can't.


I also have instructed my kids 11yr, 8yr (the other is 23months she can throw poo) what to do just in case of emergency, fire etc....

he does have a lot of heart for a small package. lol

This is slightly off topic, but very relevant. The article doesn't add much, but check out the graphic...

http://www.shtfplan.com/precious-metals/are-guns-and-ammo-the-new-gold-and-silver_12212011

They all grabbed cordless dewalt sawzaws from the local construction site. this happens all the time as well.

My dog is useless , I'm going to the beretta for enough time to grab the ar. I have an elevated position so letting one or two go by may trap some. Odds are if their kicking the door in they haven't planned to well to surprise so their intelligence level is that of a 8th grader. Odds are you'll kill a few, the cops will actually show up, and you'll most likely get charged and locked up. Never fails that the guy protecting his abode is always guilty.

1 kick to the door they get what I've got on me be it my LCP or the 1911 45

3 kicks I'm up the steps and the 11.5" AR is already charged and has 3 more mags for backups they won't last long, only one way upstairs - they had better light the house on fire to get me!

I dunno, a shotgun might take down more home-invaders faster. If they're at the door you might not need the range of a rifle. If you want more rounds then maybe look into that new Kel-Tec double magazine shotgun or even *gasp* a streetsweeper (despite their legality someone once offered to sell me one). Also the sound of a pump-action shotgun is pretty unique and a good deterrant. You could also practice the ol' load a new shell while cycling the action trick.

I've got a Mossberg Persuader (has one of the loadest pump *cha-chunk* noises). It's outfitted with a holder for extra shells, the magazine is full of buckshot/law-enforcement rounds. It's got a pistol grip for indoor maneuverability - if I need to aim it I have a green-laser affixed to the barrel (the light is strong enough to light up a room sorta). I also threw on a heatshield cause I thought it would make it look more 'boss.'





BTW, NO! I have never 'pretend' cleared the house with it [lolz], it hangs in the closet and gets oiled about thrice a year, I've only shot it a handful of times since most of the ranges here are indoors.

if you gotta use a shotty I would recommend one of these...23 rounds of "GET THE HELL OUTTA MY HOUSE!"

http://www.xrailbyrci.com/



But whatever you use I would be proficient with it...........learn to shoot offhand and reload onehanded (very very very important with a shotty) you need to be able to prop it up and rack that slide to stay in the fight which is rule #1!

Hot Dog! I just watched a couple youtube videos of that XRAIL and wawaweewa! Neat!

cz 2075. 10 rounds of .40. Just enough to have the wife loading up the garand. I'll also be single shotting the .308 while she's reloading the garand or the cz..

Off top, I have exactly
10 rounds of 40
7 rounds of .25 acp
8 rounds of .30-06
1 round of .308
6 rounds of .32 H&R mag

Before I hear click.

Then there's the reload. The cz is so I can get back to everything else. 2 entrances to the room, both on the same side of the room. Safe is in the other side.. I'm just gonna hunker down in there and shoot anything coming through the door way.

my saiga 308 and a couple 25 round mags once the first few go down im sure the crowd will disperse rather quickly there after

Shooot! 'Lizabeth, Shoot!

First I'd yell at them to leave or I was going to shoot'em. As a last resort I'd go with the AR with penetrator ammo. Shoot through the door and anyone on the other side. Easier to change mags than to reload a shotgun.

If they come right now .380 I keep that on me until I go to bed if they come in the night g21 in nightstand with 7 mags loaded 1 from capacity total of 85 rounds of .230 grain jhp all just a arms reach away, God help them if I get my ar

I have 2 1911's and 63 rounds on me at all times - it gets heavy but I am always ready.

On a more practical note, I would discourage anyone from discussing how much firepower they have at their disposal. We live in difficult times and as many of us are painfully aware - there are forces at work that may use intel against folks that are prepped or prepping. There has been much in the news that missing fingers, a 7-days worth of food reserves, even ammo & firearms are considered "identifiers" of possible "citizen terrorists."

This is a great forum and website - but as we know all too well, it is being used by government (state/federal) in an effort to thwart our 2nd Amendment Freedoms with the trumped up claim that gun sales to people that have stated they could not pass a background check occur in Virginia.

the scope and bipod is off 95% of the time thats for hunting. so i would be using the Magpul BUS

My Bulgy.

Agent , keep in mind we have alot of city folk on here who can easily be snuck up on. Not a scenario that could as easily happen to you or I however , at least not without some warning from critters. This is why I love living off the beaten path and having outside warning systems with 4 legs and fur and even a few with 2 legs and feathers.

Same. The 17 is typically always on me (if not, it's a 19). And if there was 10-15 seconds available, let's just say that AR would prove that they broke into the WRONG house.

I have an AR-15 A2 carbine , an AK-47 , a glock 23 and 1911 but my choice would be my 11-87 12 ga with 5 3 inch 00 buck , that oughta knock down 2-3 of them and if the others are smart they will split but id probably blast em heading out across the yard so they would be screwed , shouldnt have messed with the wrong house is all I can say

I'm grabbing my SBR with the 77 Grain MK262 Mod1. That should discourage them enough to move to a softer target

Or find some Harder cover!

I guess since shtf you already killed me and took my glock and m4? Since your handing them out and all.

Don't you remember, I found your mangled corpse!

LC9 is always on me but if I have a 3 second wanrning my 590SP 9 shot 12ga with 4 in the stock and 6 more on the side will say hello and goodbye at the same time.

this depends on what floor of my house im on. If its the first floor, im reaching under the couch for my 9mm. If im upstairs, the 12 gaug is in my wifes hands and the 40 is in mine.

Unless they had explosives to open the door with, their not getting in. But first they would have to be able to approach my compound over 200yds of open ground without one of my brothers snipeing them or the dogs alerting me to their presence, they won't even make it to the door!
If they make it to the door, we'll lets just say my hogs will be getting plenty of protein to eat for a day or two.
As to what I'd grab, all the doors have 870's in the rack.

If you are going to do ANYTHING to reinforce your door, please start with the hinges. IT IS THE WEAKEST POINT. Simple det cord can do them in. The dead bolt properly installed is the stronger part. Worry about that later.

12 gauge benelli nova tactical with 3 1/2 inch 00 buckshot. You think 18 balls a shot is enough?

my sgl31 (ak74) with a 45rounder in it.
whole lotta 5.45 hornady flying before i have to reload. i got 4 of those bad boys on the rig strapped to the rifle

Of all the prepping topics this is the kind of scenario that freaks me out the most. Not really sure what I would do or use since I don't have any kind of firearms yet, but hopefully would work towards preventing them from coming to my house....

I'm further back in a subdivision, so hopefully I would know they're coming before hand. If possible I may even throw stuff out in the yard, leave the doors wide open, and go hide in a safe spot in the house. To make it look like the house had been looted already. Those are just some of the ideas I have had.

I really don't know what to think about that

Well Ddraig ... everybodies gotta start somewhere and you've come to just the right spot to start yer "inventory" build up Don't let the blues getcha down man. The fact that yer searching and prepping your mind first off is a good jump ahead of the "buffaloed" masses who will wait for a "news at 6" update to clue them in (good luck on that).

Don't know how sociable or interactive your subdivision is, but the more folks you can wake up, the more eyes the "group" will have. Keep at it and don't give up !

I suggest the "Ramen" diet to "lose" ahem weight

Thanks!

Yea, just got my first gun this weekend from DK Arms at the fredricksburg gunshow. Now to find a good class, and range to shoot at

How would you recommend approaching people? I'm not a very big extrovert. In fact I try to actively avoid people in some situations.

Congratulations on making the move to protect your family and self.
I'm sure some of the members on here know of a good place to begin your training in the use of firearms close to where you live. Remember it's just a beginning, you never have learned enough or it all.


Hello my name is "your name goes here" I live across/down the street and I would to talk to you about how we can make our neighborhood safer.

Start with that.

Violence should always be a last resort.

First, just calmly say "I think it would be best if you leave now."

Then say "Fire the FPF..."



I know, I'm not being serious.

The telephone, so I can call Obama and ask him to drone strike the front door.

That is really bad ***PLAY NICE***

Sometimes marksmanship is about: sight alignment, breath control, & trigger squeeze. Sometimes: intersecting, flanking, enfilade, grazing, fire... Whatever works.

Whatever is closest to me. If I'm taken by surprise then its most likely a pistol, as it is for most of us, as the majority of us carry pistols on our person, not rifles or shotguns.

But if I had enough time to grab ONE and only ONE?

Busting down the door?

Although the shotgun would be better close quarters I think I'd want capacity...a la 1947.

Depending on the size of this hypothetical "group"... 3 guys or less, probably my Benelli M2 (set up for 3-gun: 21" barrel, 8+1) which I keep loaded with 00 buck when it's not being used for sporting purposes.

Any more than 3 guys: the AR (16" Carbine) is probably a more appropriate tool for the job.

Hesitant to admit this (as it really makes me sound like a paranoid gun nut), but I have weapons strategically placed in my home, along with a "fallback" plan, so I won't be limited to one gun. As I retreat deeper into the house more weapons will become available to me. :-)

(don't worry, I don't have children or anything, just my wife and I and we both know exactly where each gun is and what condition each is in, i.e., 0, 1, or 2)

My fnx45 tactical fitted with rmr for quick target aqusition. 15 round 45capacity. Once I get my suppressor it will be perfect. No looters in the area will hear shots fired

If I had time to get to the safe, my Saiga 12 with the drum and a couple 12 round stick mags in my pockets. The drum with S&B 12 round 00 buck works out to 240 .32 caliber ways to say go away.

If I just have my normal house gun, Glock 20 with 6" barrel, light and extended mags.

All of that might work, until the drone gets there.

I would respectfully disagree, and here's why. Especially for an introvert or someone who might be socially awkward (hey, I count myself in there in some ways), it is best to avoid the frontal approach. You need to breech the topic tactfully. The last thing you want to do is open a conversation with "making the neighborhood safe" or with anything remotely prepper- or security- or firearm-related. Especially in the climate this very minute! Do you want to be pegged as the "Neighborhood Watch Captain"? Remember that these days Up is Down, Right is Left and the things you once thought firm are pliable. While I've been delighted to see the prepper community and mindset take firm hold in the mainstream lately, I've also been dismayed at the people I once thought reasonable being turned into mental zombies. These days it is best to be cautious.

The best thing would be to approach from the flank. Strike up conversations about anything other than the topic you're really after. Sports...culture...TV shows...music; these are all good entries. But while you're doing this, learn to listen for indicators of how a person might lean opinion-wise, and I don't necessarily mean politically (although that also could be a good indicator). Once you've had a few conversations and are comfortable conversing with them, bring up a few pointed topics that can help you gauge their receptiveness. I've actually used these:

• "You know, they had generators on sale at Harbor Freight and I grabbed one because last year when the power went out we lost nearly everything in our fridge. I think I still have the coupon if you're interested in getting one." - This will give a clear indication of how concerned they are about preparing for the worst. Also it may clue you in as to whether they plan to simply mooch off of you. But even if they scoff at this, it doesn't mean they wouldn't band together for the good of a group; it merely means they don't really think ahead rationally.
• "I used to go skeet shooting a lot but I haven't in a long time. Do you ever go? Are there any good skeet ranges around here?" - Talking about skeet shooting is awesome. It's the foot massage of gun-talk. It lets you breech the subject of guns in a way that doesn't seem to mean anything, but we all know it means something. If the person recoils in disgust you can write them off for anything further gun-related -- but no worries, we were just talking about shooting skeet! If they reply enthusiastically the chances are better that they are open to other firearm related stuff. Proceed likewise with talk of other gun-related activities.
• "My cousin was living in New Orleans when Katrina hit. She says it was awful, and ever since then she stockpiles cans of food. I know! It's like that show about those preppers. But after hearing what she went through I really can't blame her." - See how this lets you play this off as someone else's "peculiarity"? Plus, you've said two magic words of the prepper movement: "New Orleans" and "Katrina" which basically gives the person in question free reign to do anything they want. You could tell them your cousin started kidnapping midgets and imprisoning them in a dungeon after that and it would be excused, with the admonition, "HEY, it was KATRINA! YOU WEREN'T THERE, MAN!"

You get the gist. The idea is to bring up the topics in an approachable way in order to see how they react. If they get a little squeamish then hold off for a while. Too many strikes and just write them off. But even a somewhat positive response could reveal someone who is willing to be converted. However, NEVER tip your hand until you are convinced they are into it at the same level as you. Even if they are somewhat lukewarm to one or two of your ideas, don't tell them about the ammo stockpile, the canned food hoard, the offline porn collection, etc.

If ever TSHTF making friends will be the number one survival skill. Best to lay the foundation now.

Im grabbing my Stihl chainsaw and cutting my way out the door they are kicking in...unless I get shot by them....then I'm gunna act like a crazed maniac once I exit and chase em off....or cut em up?......Im saving the ammo for the zombies around the corner dude.

Joe... stop being paranoid... this scenario is IMPOSSIBLE under Obama or Hitlary.

MAK 90 or Arsenal 107 with a 75 round Chinese drum.

.

Best response written. Ever.


****

Very well said and a logical method to evaluate neighbors and your mutual value to each other in an emergency.
Boomer

Get out of the house . a Molotov cocktail will bring you out anyway . I have my bug out bag , g19, Ar , bulldog, water filtration gear and trapping and fishing gear.

I have a rock, Golf Club ,Pair of scissors, and a baseball bat.

Nothing will happen...

use my naa 22 revolver, ask them to wait 5 min while i reload it.

honestly if its a large group at my door im grabbing a ar and my mag bag for the range. if i run out of mags and ammo from that bag you wont be able to see my house from the street through the stack of bodies. but most likey they will have left before first mag change.

but ive considered senarios like this. large scale looting and etc. i live in a subdivision with 1 way in and out and im friendly with my neighbors and quite a few are leo and military or retiered from one or the other. i/we plan on (ps drunken conversations) to block off the one entrance with 2 straight on gaurds behind vehicles, 1 on each side at the houses at the entrance, 1 or 2 at the house at 12 oclock from entrance that sits partly elevated on a hill and 1 at the top of the hill(about 250y out) and create a nice little kill box for any unwanted guests. once again i think the first pile of bodies will be a nice deturent for any future problems,lol

I know it a old thread but still a relative topic !!!!!

I'd call 911. And hope !! LOL

If there beating on my front door I'll be running out the back!!!!
If there bad enough to make it that far I don't want to mess with them!!!!

I really should buy a gun and ammo!!!

one thing to remember here guys with all the firearms owned or stolen by looters a house will not stop bullets, just a thought but if i was with a bunch of looters id say soften it up a bit before goin for the door, just a thought. in the situation yall are talkin about the average home defense just wont hold, a brick home is a little tougher

They would hear and see my dogs and most likely walk away, but if they didn't then I'm sure one look at "monster truck" through my front window and they would likely definitly walk away. But! If they are all smacked out on bath salts and have that look in there eyes like they are gonna eat my face and ears off, then ....
I reckon I would put monster truck and the others in the basement, push the fridge over, roll a 15 pound charge of tannerite to the door, put a helmet and a pair of goggles on, duck behind the fridge, light a cigar and let it eat.

Then tell anyone that asked , the reason that I had to dump so many ak mags was because they blew my front door up.

But like I said, I think they would turn around and go the other way:)

This is of course if I even owned a firearm

Hence new home build with concrete and steel beems

Love the shotgun for this situation. I am looking for one of the KelTec double mag guns for serious social encounters. Have a G20 with 15 rounds. Love the 10mm but the Glock is a piece of junk. I just hope it continues to cycle if I need it. I should be usefull to provide enough time to get to the 1911s and shotgun reloads, I hope. One must make do with what one has I guess.

If G20 is a junk, may be you would like to deposit it in may trash can?

Shotgun is tough to beat in any HD situation. As for the Glock , chances are it will work better than the 1911 if and when called on . My .02

Shotgun

*

Let 'Em In

Someone's knocking at the door
Somebody's ringin' the bell
Someone's knockin' at the door
Somebody's ringin' the bell
Do me a favor
Open the door and let 'em in


--Paul McCartney

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBPwZiAPlsw

Me,I'd reach for Muffin and Tater,along with a baseball bat.Working with rescue pitbulls has a distinct advantage,and after two ninety pound dogs that love me are done,I'll most likely be just leaning on the bat anyway.

Also during these times of unrest it never hurts to have a "Kill Dozer" at the ready.

We have all seen the one on YouTube and what it was capable of . Nothing like surprising your neighbors with an armored track vehicle that you secretly built in your garage out back. KNOCK. KNOCK Muther****er!!!!!!!!

Oh yeah, don't forget the shotty

Prepared?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2w8hYfGiHBg

Small group
12 gauge

****assumes I have the clarity to figure out how many****

More than 3 will probably be Sub2000 9mmwith 30 round mag and 147HPs.

I always try to keep a handgun close at hand for a surprise immediate threat , whether it be in my vehicle , out in public , at home or even in my yard or the woods , so that I can either stop or atleast pin down the threat until I can get to the shotgun or rifle , then it’s on like Donkey Kong sucker . That is what’s left after the German Shepard and Doberman leave me anything to blast , But you always have to bear in mind , that handgun might be the only thing that will save you , so you can’t always count on getting to that big gun . You have to react immediately and eliminate the threat .

And on another note , I have 1911 , Browning Hi Power , Glocks , M&P , and the Glock is still my first choice for carry and defense .

Of course , this was all before I lost all my guns in the great boat accident of 03’ .........

The Governor of Virginia has allegedly ordered a small cadre of staffers to begin the process for determining how to cut off electricity, telephones/ FAXES, Cellular phones AND DATA, as well as the Internet, in areas where he plans to send Virginia National Guard Troops to forcibly seize guns when the Democrat legislature convenes in January!

The order was allegedly given to a very small and trusted group of staffers, some of whom it turns out, do not agree (at all) with this idea.

https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php...n-confiscations